My Issue With Bernie Sanders

 

When it came time to cast vote in the Texas primary I made it no secret that I was voting for Bernie Sanders. This wasn’t out of some attempt to say Hillary wasn’t good enough, in fact she was easily more qualified on paper and I was pretty sure she would be our next president or, at the very least, that she would win the nomination.

We expected a run between Jeb and Hillary. Those were the people that the parties wanted to support going in and I can’t really remember if Jeb was still in the race by the time it came our turn to send the conventions our pick for candidates.

But I liked what I heard about Sanders and what he was saying. I thought that his ideas deserved some looking at and I thought that, maybe without the racist sentiment that haunted Obama we could sustain some of the policies that had managed to come out of the last presidency and build on to them. We had fought pretty hard for healthcare and equal rights over the last eight years, after all.

Looking back over the nine months since the inauguration of Trump and seeing the split in the Democratic Party, I’m willing to admit that I was wrong. The different things about Sanders that keep piling up at best make him out to be someone who kind of wants to fight some of the good fight, but that’s okay with those who support him engaging in terrible stuff to get there. At worst he’s actually a sheep in wolf’s clothing that attempted to use the Democratic Party as a stepping stone to build his own party with a platform of some progressive policies. I say “some” like that because his calling Planned Parenthood part of the “establishment” and his endorsement of an anti-abortion candidate paint him as a little less on the progressive end of the spectrum when it comes to women’s issues. Which is what brought this whole thing up because he is the opening speaker at the Women’s March and people are asking why.

Back in late November he also slammed what he called “identity politics” (which is a phrase I take a bit of issue with — more on that later). On Twitter and Facebook whenever there is a discussion about politics there’s no shortage of people popping up to tell you how Sanders speaks for them, even when they claim to fall under the umbrella of policies that he seems to be willing to shed in order to look more appealing.

There in-fighting that plagues the Democratic Party right now boils down to a fight about what happened. Hillary Clinton, a woman who has been in the political spotlight almost all my life, lost an election that she shouldn’t have. Some people think Bernie would have stood a better chance, even though Bernie didn’t win the primaries, even if he was pulling votes from people on the fence about Trump. The fact of the matter is that if you asked me who Bernie Sanders was in 2014 I wouldn’t know who the Hell you were talking about. Clinton has put in the work over the years trying to get healthcare reform, working at the national and state levels of government and more often than not pushing for policies that I agree with and that a lot of people seem to agree with in the Democratic Party. Most of the hate for her extends from leftover ammunition that was loaded into the gun of the Right Wing political machine that has only grown more nefarious with the rise of Breitbart and the proliferation of Fox News.

Bernie Sanders might not have loaded that gun himself, but he used it as cover fire where he could. He drew from their playbook in criticizing Clinton and when things didn’t go his way he attempted to march on Washington. He’s even attempted to hijack the party itself, a party that he really isn’t part of. He’s stolen the spotlight from Randall Woodfin, a black mayoral candidate that won an election in the Deep South who was a Hillary supporter and who ran a pretty successful campaign before Sanders’ group’s involvement. Overall Sanders backed candidates are losing, but you wouldn’t know that from the sound of things in the media. It’s like Sanders can do no wrong.

Another part of my problem with Sanders is the tone of some of the support he gets. It seems like some of it comes from alt-right types that just couldn’t get behind the blatant idiocy of Trump. You see a bit of that Gamer-Gate-Intellectual-Atheist crowd showing up to debate about free speech without seeming to realize that free speech doesn’t mean what they think. People who punch actual Nazis in the face aren’t violating the first amendment. And angry that people protest “anti-identity politics” speakers on college campuses aren’t either no matter what fucking Bill Maher says.

Well, there’s the problem. Identity politics is a conservative issue too. When you look at the fight over Confederate statues that’s tied to a racial identity in the South that has huge roots reaching back to slavery, the Jim Crow era, and the Civil Rights era. The Christian identity of the country is another hot button issue for conservatives. So this idea that it’s impossible to win elections when drawing praise from these things just doesn’t hold water. One entire political party does it and the parts of that party that don’t identify with those things ignore the parts they don’t like.

I don’t think Sanders deserved the nomination and I don’t think that he could have won. I don’t have any solid proof of that, but neither do the people claiming he would have coasted to victory. This country is racist enough against Jews that even we denied them Visas during WWII and it’s still racist enough that there’s never been a Jewish president and you can still find countless people peddling bullshit theories about the Jews doing evil things. A guy at Starbucks came up and started talking to me about Jewish mind control. That’s not even a rare thing.

And I don’t blame Sanders for the entire election loss. There is a lot things that went wrong including voter suppression, Russian intervention in the process and propaganda, and Hillary’s own decisions to campaign in certain places over others. But I do believe that Sanders being slow to back her and his march on Washington during the DNC had some affect and I think that now his attempt to gain popularity runs the risk of costing Democrats the 2018 mid-term and the possibility of Trump getting elected to a second term.

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Is This Liberalism

I have never watched many of the politics based programming on television because it wasn’t having the kind of conversations that I want to see, but HBO seems to know me. Edit: There is an error with this theme for my Wordpress where contractions in the first word apparently fuck the whole post up.

“Last Week Tonight” and “Real Time with Bill Maher” have become mainstays of my weekend shows. I tend to watch them back to back late Sunday night after everyone else is in bed. I genuinely agree with most everything Jon Oliver says, and let me tell you he had a hard sells for me. I thought I was always see him in Jon Stewart’s shadow because of his years on the “Daily Show”. After the time that he filled in for Stewart proved that he had what it took, I still remained skeptical. I mean, a big part of the show was the writing staff.

His move to HBO did him some justice though and he surpassed the “Daily Show” in my mind almost immediately.

Real Time is a different beast all together. I was the show because the guests are people that I want to see discuss things. I skipped an episode once (the one with Milo Yiannopoulos) because I felt that even giving that kind of person a platform to reach more people was in bad taste, but the more I hear about the episode the more that I think I should have watched it.

There’s a phenomena in the liberal community that seemed to be at its height right after the election. The idea at its best is that social issues are less important and that we should concentrate on the big things and at its worse there are those who are only able to care about the issues that affect them directly.

Marijuana legalization would be a pretty big deal considering the number of people locked up for such a minor drug, but when that’s the only thing you’re considering important in a world with out of control pay inequality and where people are literally dying while the government could do something about then there’s something seriously wrong.

And let me just say that social issues do mean a lot. Maybe you’re not gay or black or hispanic or a woman, but a hell of a lot of people are and these issues are their day to day lives. Bill Maher brings legalization pretty often and he treats the whole thing with a sort of reverence. This past week when comments Bill O’Reilly made about Rep. Maxine Waters’s hair came up on Maher’s show her immediately shot the whole story down and say liberals sweat the small stuff. Let’s try to remember that the guy shot down a valid point she made about Trump by saying  “I didn’t hear a word she said. I was looking at the James Brown wig.”

There’s layers of hypocrisy to the statement itself, especially when O’Reilly is defending a man who has the hair that Trump does. But then add to that how Maher handles the statement by dismissing the whole thing too.

Maher is one of the only ones I see on the airwaves doing this kind of thing, but he represents a swath of the liberal population that seems to be unconcerned with real gender and racial equality and treat it like one of those things that we’ll get to after all of the other things are done.

So what party is left for the rest of us? We’ve got one that openly vilifies us and another that thinks of us as an afterthought or votes in their pocket to be drummed up every four years when they need us, but forgotten any other time.

I got into liberalism because I felt that it was the ideology that served the People with a capital “P”. I was pretty conservative for years and I grew up going to Catholic school and thought abortion was wrong and that we had to be patriotic and stand by our President no matter what things he did. I found those policies didn’t work for me slowly over time and I grew up and learned what was important to me.

If liberalism doesn’t represent the people and work for the good of everyone, what good is it to us? Liberalism that doesn’t do that doesn’t even seem like liberalism at all.

 

Pornography is Media too and it doesn’t exist in a vacuum.

A woman who has her reputation built in the pornography and sex industry has come out in support some troubling things. Jenna Jameson, who had earlier backed Trump, defended the KKK and spoke out about the “Muslim rape gangs overrunning Sweden” on Twitter.

There’s nothing inherently wrong with selling sex, pornography, or even prostitution in theory–but there seems to be a long history of people exploiting women rather than empowering them in these industries and in the case of porn, there’s a long history of racism, in fact there’s enough of it that it’s probably the only thing you can Google with the word “porn” in it and not find actual porn on the first page. Here’s another link for the sake of having it here.

 

No one should be saying that she doesn’t have the right to an opinion. I don’t believe in the argument against celebrities stepping into the limelight to voice their problem with something in the country. After all, they’re citizens the same way we are, the things that plague our country affect them and their children and families.

The issue I have with this is it all seems kind of odd what she’s defending. The KKK, the extremist wings of the Christian Right, the Alt-Right and their band of Neo-Nazis propped up by the likes of Breitbart are the same people who claim women don’t have a voice or claim that women are worthless. Remember that there was some claim that women voting was part of the problem when it looked to most people like Trump was going to lose.

I don’t think that it’s a hard line connecting the racism of the sex industry with the racism of one of it’s workers. Every person in an organization doesn’t have to subscribe to the tenants of where they work. But doesn’t it feel odd that one of the favorite insults of the Alt-Right Gamer Gate types has it’s roots in porn where a white man watches as his wife is taken and used by a black man (we’re talking about the word “cuck” here)? Doesn’t it feel like something is up when the men who label porn online can’t seem to stop referring to the women as sluts, whores, cunts, or whatever else long enough to write a title?

We talk about attitudes about race being affected by the entertainment we intake. Minorities being normalized by appearing in normal roles in television shows and movies and books. Movies still get blasted when they change the race of a character in a way that might be perceived as more “PC” or even when roles are written from scratch and cast with minorities in mind.

These things aren’t brought up in reference to pornography though. The advent of the internet brought with it the unexpected golden age of porn. Where someone fifteen years older than me grew up hiding crinkled images stolen from an old magazine in a lock box a teen in the early 2000s  could find a treasure trove of pictures just by typing a misspelled “pussie” into his search bar. There is already talk about what that does to a kid sexually, but what about what it adds to their view of other races and sex?

Look at the front page of a porn site’s long list of categories. Click through some even. It’s hard to find a video of someone black having sex where their blackness isn’t what the video uses as a selling point. The same can be said about other types of people too. Everyone is broken down by category. Blondes. Redheads. Chubby. MILF. But finding a black couple is like finding a four leafed clover and when your view of sex and relationships is shaped partially by porn from a young age (which it shouldn’t be in the first place) everything in porn is telling you “these people aren’t the norm”.

Now, does this shit doesn’t really matter? The good porn is on Tumblr or Reddit anyway and it’s made by regular people who are brave enough to put themselves out there, not an industry that’s breaking everyone down into categories…but then what about this generation? The one right now. People younger than thirty-five and in middle-class America grew up on this. Shaved genitals have become such a big thing that crabs are almost gone and that came about around the time the internet showed us that women are supposed to look like Barbie Dolls down there. Porn might even be changing how we feel about sex.

If it can do all that, why would we say it can’t have an affect on the kind of couples we see as normal? Why does it matter that a woman with more than 35 Adult Video Awards to her name is saying racist shit on Twitter? We don’t exist in a vacuum and, like it or not, the things we intake do have some effect on us. Did porn make Jenna Jameson racist? I can’t say one way or another. But being told that you’re more valuable than someone as a performer because of their color of your skin seems like it is the kind of thing that might start to sink in after a while.

Scared For The Future of My Country

I’ve been stressed. I stopped by Wendy’s earlier and couldn’t finish a medium meal, which is not normal for me. Sleep is hard to come by and in the mornings I’m awake but don’t want to get up.

I lay in bed on my phone talking to friends and trying to avoid the bad news on sites like Reddit or Facebook. I throw on the MBMBAM podcast, but part of the way through I realized I’ve zoned out and don’t know what they’re laughing at. I missed the entirety of the last goof.

Work is surprising in that it is calming. No one really brings up the outside issues there and not many people really talk to me. I kind of like it that way. But the fact of the matter is it’s an election year and the things coming out of this election are causing me to be really afraid for my country.

Think that a few years ago a statement about binders of women or a weird scream was enough to get you flack. I miss the days of Bush and Romney when I look at the candidate that people have chosen to support.

There’s such an undercurrent of hatred in this election and the odd thing is that the guy stirring it up is somehow saying he’s the victim. He’s calling Mexicans rapists and bragging about sexual assault. He’s saying he wants to bring back unconstitutional stop and frisk laws and that he wants to default on our debt (which puts the world economy at risk). He’s asking why we don’t use nukes more often.

Notice I didn’t cite any of that. Mostly because it doesn’t matter. I’m on a phone and I won’t waste my time making the buggy copy paste system work for people who either know all that already or refuse to believe it. Even though it’s fact. It’s recorded that Trump has said these things; we’ve become anti-fact.

And the thing is what he’s taken advantage of scares me as much as Trump, because it will continue win or lose. There’s not really a chance for a conversation with people who are threatening to commit acts of terror against foreigners or “grab their musket” if they don’t get their way.

I’m thinking maybe America isn’t the place for me and a lot of people seem to not want people like me here. I’m thinking maybe this doesn’t get better after this.

Since people question my personhood still of ponder the idea of women not being able to vote can we really even say that we tried?

The Bare Minimum

I’ve been hearing more and more about the wealth gap in this country and how it affects the poorer, majority of Americans. I hate to dwell on it and really go off on this long rant about what’s happening, but basically there are people out there who think they deserve to make more than they do right now.Federal-Minimum-Wage-1

And these people are absolutely right. The price of everything has gone up, but the cost of making it seems to have either gone down or stayed the same while the pay for those doing the making…has stayed the same. Just look at gasoline—do you think that modern refineries work harder to produce a product?

The price of gas in just the years I have been driving has gone up 400%, yet the minimum wage still hovers around seven dollars for a vast part of the country. Value meals at fast food places, the cost of living in general—it’s all gone up. Inflation is kind of expected, but the minimum wage should keep the pace with it. Issue is that it hasn’t.

My problem in this post is less with the wage itself and more with the people arguing against others getting a higher wage. There seems to be this overwhelming sentiment that others shouldn’t get a wage that’s higher because “I work my ass off and I’m not getting paid more”.

Then your problem should be with the employer, not with the others trying to do better for themselves. As Americans it seems we’re cultured and trained to think that sick days, vacation, pensions and unions are for the weak or the lazy and that if you’re a true, red blooded patriot that you’ll work your job and if you don’t like how you’re treated you’ll find somewhere else to work. I’m not sure how we started to think we were the greatest place on Earth or how we collectively got so stupid as to be duped into a way of thinking that makes us expendable basically sets us up to be shit on.

I’m reminded of a line from one of my favorite shows “Louie”:

“The only time you should look at your neighbors bowl is to make sure they have enough.”

Another Shooting

Bpx-0sjCcAAh5LYA wall of ambulances and police cars outside of high schools, aerial shots of everyday people darting away in tight lines with their hands covering the backs of their heads, an exposé on the gunmen where we find out that the warning signs were there. This all seems so familiar because it’s becoming a part of everyday life.

Reynolds High School in Oregon has become the fourth location to experience a shooting in the past three weeks. Fifth if you want to count the one that happened in Canada, but it really isn’t part of the same trend; these things don’t happen nearly as often there.

It’s safe to say that we’ve got a problem here. A problem with gun registration and the flow of guns onto the streets and how easily one can get a gun and a problem with the the mentally ill not being properly looked after and cared for. People can complain that their gun rights are at risk, but in all honesty nothing has been done to their gun rights at all to stop this from happening.

We can at least say that there was something done for the healthcare issue with reforms being put up that could have effected the mentally ill. Even then, it’s not enough. The issue of what to do about guns isn’t hard to deal with—the issue is that we aren’t even allowed to have the discussion.

In full, my a friend of mine said this:

There is absolutely no contradiction between upholding the Second Amendment, and providing a robust regime of time, place and manner restrictions on that right. So let’s close the gaping loopholes in our gun laws. And to that end, let’s give states and local governments the ability to tailor the rules to their own need.

The point gun law should be to make compliance the only reasonable option. So let’s treat guns with the same regulatory regime that we treat motor vehicles with. If you can prove you’re not a moron, congrats, you can have your guns, but their registered to you, and you’re responsible to report when they’ve been lost or stolen. Hell, we’ll even let you do it when you get/renew your driver’s license, and we won’t make you renew that part. Ensure that all new guns being manufactured in a manner that makes it very hard to remove registration information. And give people tax credits for doing their civic duty to the militia and being a responsible gun owner so they don’t bitch too much.

You would be able to cut down on gun-violence and would in no way interfere with the second amendment right to keep and bear arms.

One would think that was the kind of comment to end the whole discussion, but nope. I think there’s about twenty more comments after that and most of them ignore the intelligent things stated above and how easy it is to make these things seem reasonable. We do this for cars. I mean we make you bring your car to a place every year and get it inspected. Then we make you legally responsible for the upkeep and mechanical failure of the car, the insurance and registration.

This all seems reasonable with cars because we’ve dealt with it so long, but there had to be a time before all of this. New things don’t usually come prepackaged with their own set of ready made laws.

Until we actually make an effort to do something about guns this is going to continue to happen because we are doing nothing about it. How do we expect it to stop or change when we’re just sitting on our hands ignoring the larger problems?

The Most Endangered Species on the Planet

antiracisthitlerIn the wake of the George Zimmerman trial I got into a fight about the idea of racism in general. I don’t remember the exact details of the exchange that brought about this topic. That was an eventful week on the Internet for me, to tell the truth. I don’t think I can remember a time where people so blatantly made racist remarks.

Somehow the idea of interracial dating came into question and I posted my thoughts on it. Another person linked me to this video by White Rabbit Radio.

I had never heard of White Rabbit Radio, but that could be because I don’t hang out on racist forums like Stormfront or attend any Klan meetings. What I came across was a lot of things about White Nationalism and a “mantra” of beliefs that I’ve been hearing for years now and never realized were from a single source.

It happens from time to time that we come across something that seems too rehearsed and planned out to just be a coincidence. Like if Aliens were to land in three Catholic Churches in three different countries and hear the Nicene Creed. They would be able to automatically recognize that these people share a common source for their belief. They might not know where that source was instantly, but it’s clear that everyone repeating that, though it might be in different languages is related in faith.

That was how this looked. And to someone who doesn’t realize what they’re reading, it can look like this type od thing is everywhere and it’s engrained in people. This repetition of the mantra not only gives these racists a common goal to work toward. It gives racist non-whites a common enemy and a reason to believe that all whites feel this way. Why else would these simple ideas be so prevalent?

It’s not uncommon to be around non-whites when you’re not white and have them strike up talk about how someone white was racist, even if you witnessed the same event and there’s a far more reasonable explanation. Racist ideologies drive a wedge between races from both sides.

You might have witnessed the mantra yourself in some form. It’s basic main idea is that: “Anti-racist is code word for anti-white.” It goes on to point out that diversity is bad and it’s only ever forced on white people. Most of the text reads like:

“Everybody says there is this race problem. Everybody says this race problem will be solved when the third world pours into every white country and only into white countries. … Everybody says the final solution to this race problem is for every white country and only white countries to ‘assimilate,’ i.e., intermarry, with all those non-whites. … But if I tell that obvious truth about the ongoing program of genocide against my race, the white race, Liberals and respectable conservatives agree that I am a naziwhowantstokillsixmillionjews [sic].”

The idea is almost sound and the man who wrote it, Robert Whitaker, claims to be a genius who worked on Regan’s staff and is partially responsible for the fall of Communism. And these ideas were said to be part of the motivation in some violent crimes, the most noteworthy of which is the shooting perpetrated by Anders Breivik, the Norwegian terrorist who slaughtered 77 people two years ago in his home country.

This article outlines a lot of the things I’ve said here and it goes into the details about the background of the whole situation. On the surface even the video has huge issues that anyone who looks at it with a non-biased eye will see it. For instance, the video seems to think that Israel only has Jews in it. It doesn’t there are Arabs living in Israel peacefully. The other issue is that these arguments seem to make the claim that simply allowing diversity is the death of a race. The only issue is that people will still choose to marry within their own culture and race some of the time. No one is being forced to marry outside of their race.

Other than that the video is downright offensive and the whole thing about the people running the websites and spreading this message let it be known what is really going on here. People are afraid of diversity, even when it’s to the benefit of everyone and even when it’s what some people want. They seem to think their culture is being wiped out when in many cases it’s being spread around the world through mediums like the internet at an alarming rate.

And even if a culture melds into another that’s what things are supposed to do. That’s the natural evolution of things.

Rape

Something needs to be done about the way we handle rape in this society. Now, I know that you’re thinking I mean one thing. Based on most of what is posted on this blog, you would only be right to guess I mean we need to deal with rapists themselves more harshly.

I’m all for that, but it’s not what I’m talking about.

We need to do something about the way we handle the subject of rape. You might find this shocking, but the truth of the matter is I think we need to stop restricting the subject of rape so hard. People are ostracized when they make a comment about rape at times. It’s one of the only subjects that when joked about people start boycotting and getting very upset.

I know that this might sound like a contradictory. But if you think about how much shame there is attached to rape it’s pretty apparent that part of the problem is the fact that we never talk about it. We don’t allow comedians to make jokes pertaining to the subject, even when the joke is saying something anti-rape or trying to prove the point that rape is horrible.

Rape is shameful, the word is treated as special, like it’s worse than fuck or cunt in some circles. To add insult to injury, people who want to be rebels use the word as if to make light of it. The same people running around the internet who think saying faggot and nigger makes them look tough are just as likely to cling to the word rape as a way to express themselves.

You hear it all of the time in games online: “I’m getting raped down here!”

I’m not saying we should make fun of rape. Or that rape is something we should be making fun of or making into a less serious issue. But what I am saying is that we should talk about rape more the same way we talk about other things. Sure, you could claim that it could trigger feelings in some people, but it would be less likely to do so if they didn’t have to feel so ashamed about rape.

Shame that’s exacerbated because we treat the subject like Voldemort’s name and don’t really have frank or even not-so-frank conversations about it.

That’s the Sound of Shit Hitting Fans

I’ve lived in Houston most of my life and there’s been various degrees of racial tension over the course of my life. I tend to not be as easily offended by things that happen as other blacks I know. I feel that many of them are being irrational much of the time.

The Trayvon Martin killing isn’t one of those times. I’m a firm believer in gun rights and being able to protect one’s self and your own property. But once you go out following people around and getting out of your car where you think dangerous people might be I feel like you’re getting into vigilante territory. When you shoot someone for a situation that you escalated after being told to lay off by police dispatchers I feel like there needs to be more investigation done than just letting the shooter go free.

George Zimmerman wasn’t tested for drugs or even arrested. Nothing was done until forty-four days after the fact. That’s odd. Contrast that with the man who shot too minorities here in Houston defending his neighbor’s house. I supported that man and he had his day in court and was let off without jail time. But he didn’t seem to be trying to run from what he did.

993604_783193672625_508761769_nAdd to that the supporters of Zimmerman being often times strangely excited and proclaiming that a seventeen year old deserved to die for hitting someone who had followed him (which could be seen as a threat). I hate to scream racism, because people so often accuse blacks of doing just that in any situation. But it seems peculiar how little was done in the early stages by the police. It seems odd that some of the evidence that could have gone either way was presented one way because the one survivor of the confrontation said it worked out like that.

Back to what I said about Houston. We’re not a riot/looting/protesting city. Our Police will shoot you. Doesn’t matter what race, age or socioeconomic class. They’ve got huge, giant, goliath balls. The kind of balls that gods think of as large. So when I heard there were protestors blocking 288 today with a casket screaming for justice I got worried. I feel like this has been a long time coming. Racism isn’t going to go away because we deny that it happens. We can’t continued to have two justice systems. We can’t continue to let states like Florida use racism to grade students and turn a blind eye.

Why should the color of my skin make people think I’m less valuable, less intelligent, less worthy of a chance?

It’s just bullshit.

Books and Boobies: I Liked the Title so Much I Stole It

article-2336936-1A2EB227000005DC-690_634x420A few days ago I read something over on Hello Giggles about women trying to change how people viewed shiftlessness and gender by reading in the park topless. When I first posted the story on a forum I frequent I expected that more men would be excited for obvious reasons. Even men who aren’t particularly fond of women’s rights usually like breasts and if they were out all of the time, where’s the harm?

Well apparently these men are now worried that it will make them uncomfortable. Breasts are meant to be sexual and they shouldn’t be out for that reason. Here’s just a few of the things people responded with:

More idiots going topless.
The only people who support this are morons and perverts.
I like tits as much as the next guy, but this isn’t getting any point across other than how little self respect these feminist cunts have for themselves and others.
If guys don’t see you as equals with it on, they’re gonna see you as EVEN LESS with it off.

and

if you’re a fatass it’d harm my eyes

and

________ isn’t wrong, these women are idiots
Nobody wants to see your tits unless you’re part of the relatively small physically fit 18-30 female demographic, and suggesting that everyone should have to suffer the rolls and bags of outrageous fortune so that men can enjoy topless young women and young women can enjoy being topless
is just
Jesus Christ
Intelligence, perspective, self-respect and respect for others all severely lacking here.

and also

If a woman walked up to a man and touched his chest what would you think of it? If a man walked up to a woman and touched her chest what would you think of it? I don’t have a problem with walking around topless, or bottomless for that matter, but at the same time I believe some members in this thread are being hypocritical. If the situation was flipped I don’t think individuals would have a problem coming up with reasons why a man and woman’s chest should be treated/viewed differently.

and

Cause its sexualy related. The same reason I can’t walk around naked, the public does not want to see my black dick swinging everywhere, and the public does not want to see females tits while they play with there kids at the park. This is a society so what the people want does matter, and I can’t think of any reason why someone needs to expose there chest(male/female) under normal circumstances to begin with.
Men can walk around without a shirt as a mans chest is not associated to sex by the majority, although dont misunderstand a large number of people want men to cover up as well. Just not enough to make it a law.

The problem I’m having with all of this is that a lot of men seem to be uncomfortable with the idea of a woman shirtless around them, especially if they can’t touch her in the same way they might want to. There seems to be a sudden worry about the comfort level of men. The thing is that a lot of time when women are made uncomfortable they’re told that they’re being weak, they get ridiculed or told they’re being passive aggressive bitches.

We should tell these men the same thing. I think that over time, if this happened more often, it might start to change things a little bit and we might see some differences when it comes to how men view women overall. A lot of the reason we used to cover women up was because their body was seen as property and we still have this mindset that their bodies are meant to be enjoyed sexually for one person, but aren’t their own at the same time. Women are expected to act more out of sexuality and attractiveness than they are out of comfort.

And if you’re comfortable with your breasts out, who am I to say you can’t do that?